WEBVTT

NOTE
This transcript was created on 2026-05-10 at 19:06:03

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Hello, dear listeners and welcome back to Jody Interterterra, the

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only Doctor Who Flash cast, delighted to be covering an episode

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named after the sound that the evil villain's plan makes.

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We are here. to discuss Pete McTai's episode of Doctor Who.

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The 7th episode of the series Kablam.

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And it's the 1st it's the 1st series.

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It's the 1st episode to have an exclamation mark in the title.

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So that's the thing?

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Yeah, I think there are other Doctor Who stories that would

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benefit from an exclamation mark in the title.

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Timelash.

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Frontios.

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Inferno?

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No, that's the night club.

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Ambassadors of death.

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Actually, that, yeah, that's the one that would benefit the most.

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I did see Pete on Facebook earlier saying he was proud of doing

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something that had never been done before.

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So there you go.

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So I think that people are generally very positive about this

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episode.

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What did you think, Brendan?

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Um, yeah, I really quite enjoyed it.

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I think I've been saying for a couple of weeks that what I would

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really, really like to see is more of a sort of rompy action

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adventure and I think we had that.

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We had a mystery that the doctor got involved in.

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Um, We had likeable um, we had likeable characters.

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We had a whodunit structure with uh pretty much, almost all the

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supporting characters, at some point or another, are under

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suspicion, have motive, and have, um, uh, basically believable

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opportunity to be the one sort of behind the mystery of people uh

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disappearing, uh, or uh, being killed, and we don't quite know

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what's happening all the way through. um I think this is possibly

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the uh 1st episode since episode one where all 4 of the main cast

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are well used and everyone gets something to do.

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Um that is germane to their character.

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Um, I re- I really love whenever they pair up Ryan and Yaz.

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I think they have a, they have a great chemistry and I, I kind of

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like that.

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Early on, there were some hints of an attractional romance between

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them and we haven't had many of those recently and I kind of, I

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kind of like that.

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I feel like that would be, um, sort of a cliche thing to do with

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their characters and it kind of felt shoehorned in when they've

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done it before.

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So I just like seeing them hanging out as mates.

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I suppose.

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They like each other so much.

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It's so nice.

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I thought that this might have been Ryan's best episode so far.

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He was really great in it.

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He was super funny as well.

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Now when he talks about what he used to hide in the trainers, he

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goes to make this sort of hilarious hand movement before the

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doctor kind of shots him up.

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So great.

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What did you think of them, Tom?

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Oh sorry.

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No, no, go on.

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Yeah, Todd, what did you think?

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I adored this episode.

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I just relaxed into it.

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Peter's dialogue is just so natural for all the characters

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especially for the doctor and everything that Brendan said holds

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completely true.

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I was intrigued.

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I was into the story, kept my attention.

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Other episodes have not kept my attention.

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He's done himself proud.

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I was talking to him a couple of weeks ago and he's so humble.

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Because I said how much I adored Rosa.

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And he said, oh, you'll then like demons episode.

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They'll probably be your favourites of the season.

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And although I think Rosa is, this is, this, for me, is the best

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of everything else and I really just, I just enjoyed it.

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I enjoyed Jody, I enjoyed everybody. everybody had their moments

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everybody had humour.

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Every, it was just, it was just what I, I've been wanting.

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Really.

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So I'm really happy.

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So, yeah, great.

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Yeah, yeah, well, James.

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Oh, look.

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Oh, you know, I agree, generally, with whatever he's saying.

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I thought it was fun.

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It was sweet, especially Kira.

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She was she was dead sweet.

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Dead. and then just dead.

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Yeah.

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Which is like, as soon as, like, you get to like the character, you

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know, she's going to get killed horribly.

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Well, same with Dan, I think, with Lee Max, Dan.

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Yeah, yeah.

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It's like this series has been very good at making you like people

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and then killing them off in terrible, horrible ways.

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Well, from the very 1st episode.

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And look, I mean, that that gives it some sort of emotional weight

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that, um, maybe it might be lacking if, if, if there weren't such

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good actors, uh, portraying these guest roles.

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I like, you see, I like all the guest roles too, James.

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I like the people.

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I think Julie Hesmondhole. is so superb.

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Like, and, you know, you can't believe that she hasn't been in

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Doctor Who before.

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And I think, you know, there was a fair bit of exposition in the

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world building here, but because it was delivered in scenes where

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like likeable characters were talking, you know, where we were

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learning more about the characters and about the world at the same

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time, it didn't, you know, like it didn't seem to be a problem.

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It wasn't just some, you know, some previous episodes, I think

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have been really exposition heavy, but here I didn't really feel

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it.

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Sorry, Todd.

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Yeah, yeah, I completely agree with you, Nathan.

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I think too.

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There's some touches here like references to modern who and old

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who as well.

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Unlike those licings on the top, you know, for us, little Easter

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eggs.

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I think I think the 2 big ones are obviously the deadly bubble

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wrap, which has to be from Pete's childhood memories of Arc in

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space.

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And the death's unaccountable file that they come across that

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Slade is keeping about the missing persons.

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It's never mentioned explicitly.

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It's a locked filing cabinet.

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Yes, exactly.

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I also thought them hiding behind that artwork was a bit like

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robots of death, you know?

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Oh, yeah. mixed of pyramids of Mars.

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Yeah.

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Look, also, I mean, I just, I loved the, the wasp joke.

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Yeah.

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And the fez.

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Yes, yeah.

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Yeah, good references delivered in a way that doesn't drag down

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story.

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Well, I mean, she made some reference about meeting Mount Batten

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last week, which we've never seen on screen.

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It wouldn't matter if you didn't know that she hadn't met Agatha

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Christie on screen. you know what I mean?

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That's just a funny, sort of funny reference.

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And it's the doctor's been name dropping all year, I think.

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So I thought that that was really good.

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I did have some political reservations about it.

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And it's funny this year that every sort of Doctor Who comment

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thread has people complaining that it's all PC crap and full of

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social justice warriors. because I don't know, there are non-white

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people on it. and women and things.

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And that, but to me, you know, this, this series has been a bit a

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political or a bit sort of clumsily a political, despite all of

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the, you know, historicals and stuff.

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And here, I think, you know, because we, the plot, you know, Pete

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knows how these stories work, um, the, you know, things like

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sunmakers or um, Paradise Towers or um, Gridlock, where there's

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this sort of weird world.

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And the, the doctor's job is normally to tear it down, but the

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twist is that it's the system that's asking for help.

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And, you know, the most obvious villain who's slayed, because he's

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awful, has to not be the obvious villain, otherwise it doesn't

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work as a whodunit.

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I didn't, I didn't get that he was, the Herman's man was going to

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be the villain.

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I just thought it was so clever in retrospect that the system

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actually put her into the maintenance, you know, and Graham ended

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up going there.

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I just liked that as I you got me on that one, Pete, you know?

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Yeah, I think so you think the system put the doctor into

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maintenance in order to, because it knew, because that one tries

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to kill him in Slade's office.

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So the system knows that it's Charlie.

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I mean, it could have sent, help me, a guy called Charlie is, you

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know, trying to blow everyone up.

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But I don't know, maybe the font was too big for the packing sleep

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or something.

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Well, I kind of wonder if the system is an emergent sentence.

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Yeah.

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You know, it so it still has, it has trouble communicating.

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And um, something we were discussing in the text thread last night

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was, you know, okay, so the system is the one under attack, but it

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then takes someone and kills them, you know, to prove a point.

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But that cast my mind to something that's happening right now in

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the development of driverless cars.

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They're programming the cars that if the car is in a situation

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where it is going to crash into a group of 3 people or it's going

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to crash into a group of 10 people, it will steer to the group of

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3 people.

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It's the idea that...

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Yeah, yeah, the sorry problem.

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It, you know, it, yes, it kills Kira, but it kills Kira because

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there are 10s of 1000s of robots about to go out and kill 10s of

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1000s of random people.

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Yeah.

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I think, you know, like we we talked about the trolly problem.

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I think it was, I think, that not having the doctor address how

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evil the system was directly was an omission.

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And, and, you know, we, like, because we know Amazon and how

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incredibly evil Amazon is, you know, well, no, there are people

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you know, wearing adult diapers on the, on the, on the conveyor

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belts because they're so closely monitored in terms of toilet

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brakes and stuff like that.

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Like they're an evil company.

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Um, and, and, you know, uh, Kablam, the 1st, you know, 40 minutes

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shows how evil the company is.

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All of that sort of cheery stuff about private conversations and

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things.

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I think the thing is that the difference, I think, is that the

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system is not for company.

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Yeah, the system is the is the computer that's running the

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company.

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It's it's probably, I mean, you could you could argue it's as much

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of a slave as the people doing the manual.

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Yeah, I think, though, metaphorically because it's called the

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system.

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Like there is a whole heap of sort of science fiction stuff in

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between a sort of direct interpretation of what's going on.

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And, you know, you can't quite map it onto Amazon.

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But I still think that, you know, this, I would have liked to have

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seen Judy and Slade, who is a horrible person, you know, dressed

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down by the doctor.

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You know, the idea that late capitalism will just end up being

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nice to you, of your own accord later, and you shouldn't do

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anything to intervene.

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You know, I don't think that that was an intentional message of

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the episode, but it's certainly the message that some people are

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getting.

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And, you know, yeah.

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I think that I think it's good in that it is a thought-provoking

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episode and it's getting people angry about both the themes in the

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episode and the way that they were handled and, you know, I did

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feel uncomfortable with, you know, Charlie.

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On the one hand, um, sort of being a, you know, a people power

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person and free the workers and what have you.

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But on the other hand, being a homicidal maniac.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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But I think what it comes down to is, uh, you mentioned the sun

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makers earlier, but this is not, this episode does not have the

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morality of the sun makers, it has the morality of the dinosaurs.

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Because it may have gone to a, it doesn't end with the doctor

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turning around and saying, well, I'll, I'll fix up the pollution

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of your planet using galafrain technology.

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It ends with the doctor saying, yeah, this world is screwed up and

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it is polluted, but you can't wipe out a bunch of people to prove

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your point.

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You have to take what you've got and improve it.

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Yeah, that's that's what happens at the end and it's uncomfortable

248
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and it's not solved.

249
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But I went from thinking, oh, that's a massive oversight to

250
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thinking, actually no, I think this might be deliberate.

251
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Yeah, yeah, I, I, like my feeling is, and I don't know, that the

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desire to, to have the twist. meant that the, something, you know

253
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something went wrong awry with the politics of it.

254
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And yeah, like that it was a storytelling, the storytelling was a

255
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priority, which is a good priority and clearly why it's been so

256
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well received.

257
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I mean, we've seen any number of episodes where the doctor comes

258
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in and sort of tears it down and it's nice to be surprised.

259
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But there is something this season, I think, where they've made a

260
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deliberate and laudable choice to tone the doctor down.

261
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You know, she's not a superhero who comes in and tears down your

262
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world anymore.

263
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She's a traveller who's here to help.

264
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But it does mean that she's a bit passive, I think, this year.

265
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And she's terribly nice.

266
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And it was nice.

267
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And it was nice to see you not being...

268
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You know, she has a little quip, she has a little aside.

269
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She has little threats and I just like that voice in this

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episode.

271
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So, yeah, no doctor episode is perfect and I can live with.

272
00:14:30.539 --> 00:14:31.679
Yeah, yeah.

273
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I could a good episode is a good episode.

274
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And she was fabulous stressing down Slade and Maddox, like Julie

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in that episode.

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Just wonderful.

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And I was so glad that Julie didn't end up being evil.

278
00:14:46.379 --> 00:14:47.580
Yes, yeah.

279
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She was so Mrs. Foster or Mrs. Flux or something and, you know, it

280
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ended up not being that.

281
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What I really like doing, that's all right.

282
00:14:55.799 --> 00:14:59.279
What I really like in her dressing down of duty is later on when

283
00:14:59.279 --> 00:15:04.200
she catches them in the office, the doctor reminds her, yeah, no

284
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I'm still looking at you.

285
00:15:05.100 --> 00:15:08.460
You know, and now that I know a bit more of what's going on.

286
00:15:08.519 --> 00:15:09.840
Do you have something to tell me yet?

287
00:15:09.899 --> 00:15:13.320
Like, am, you know, the doctor, the doctor keeps pressing it.

288
00:15:13.379 --> 00:15:16.320
It's not just a moment of, you know, if I don't like it, I'm going

289
00:15:16.320 --> 00:15:16.740
to stop it.

290
00:15:16.799 --> 00:15:18.659
It's a moment of, okay, I still don't like this.

291
00:15:18.720 --> 00:15:21.240
I'm giving you a chance to tell me if you're involved.

292
00:15:21.299 --> 00:15:22.019
Yeah.

293
00:15:22.080 --> 00:15:27.299
You know, it's, it's, it's, I think the Davison comparisons we've

294
00:15:27.299 --> 00:15:31.679
been making with Jody is a real, a real thing because Davison's

295
00:15:31.679 --> 00:15:34.019
doctor wants to knock around the universe having fun and playing

296
00:15:34.019 --> 00:15:37.259
cricket and all these nasty things keep getting in the way.

297
00:15:37.320 --> 00:15:38.100
Yeah.

298
00:15:38.100 --> 00:15:42.059
And when they get in the way he gets very frustrated and very

299
00:15:42.059 --> 00:15:42.480
annoyed.

300
00:15:42.840 --> 00:15:47.580
Do you know, I think it's like Hartnell, where the 3 leads have a

301
00:15:47.580 --> 00:15:49.559
crazy friend who gets them into trouble.

302
00:15:50.220 --> 00:15:52.799
Yes, let's go with Hartnell.

303
00:15:52.860 --> 00:15:54.059
That makes me much happier.

304
00:15:54.120 --> 00:15:55.019
Much better.

305
00:15:55.080 --> 00:15:57.419
But do you know what I mean?

306
00:15:57.480 --> 00:16:00.899
Like, she, she is just a traveller.

307
00:16:00.960 --> 00:16:05.820
She's not this sort of fetishized superhero and she doesn't do the

308
00:16:05.820 --> 00:16:08.759
sort of snarling David Tennant tea thing.

309
00:16:08.940 --> 00:16:16.559
But I would like to see her a little bit more kind of, um, I'd

310
00:16:16.559 --> 00:16:18.720
like to see her tear down the world once or twice.

311
00:16:18.779 --> 00:16:19.740
You know what I mean?

312
00:16:19.799 --> 00:16:21.960
Maybe you might get that in the finale.

313
00:16:22.080 --> 00:16:28.259
I I called the finale, the Battle, the Battle of the Cat just

314
00:16:28.259 --> 00:16:31.080
walked across my keyboard the other night when I was talking to

315
00:16:31.080 --> 00:16:31.500
Brandon.

316
00:16:31.559 --> 00:16:33.539
I still don't know how to pronounce it.

317
00:16:33.659 --> 00:16:35.039
Yeah.

318
00:16:35.039 --> 00:16:38.159
But yeah, I'm with Todd.

319
00:16:38.220 --> 00:16:44.100
I think her lack of direct involvement and direct action, we might

320
00:16:44.100 --> 00:16:47.279
say, is something they're building up to.

321
00:16:47.340 --> 00:16:51.480
She's going to face a choice and either choice is going to be a

322
00:16:51.480 --> 00:16:54.600
terrible choice and I think that's going to be the finale.

323
00:16:55.559 --> 00:16:56.940
Yeah.

324
00:16:57.000 --> 00:16:57.960
Yeah.

325
00:16:58.019 --> 00:16:58.860
I hope so.

326
00:16:58.919 --> 00:17:01.860
I do hope that they're building up to, you know, addressing that

327
00:17:01.860 --> 00:17:03.000
in some way.

328
00:17:03.299 --> 00:17:10.079
But in any case, like this was a hell of an enjoyable episode, an

329
00:17:10.079 --> 00:17:11.220
absorbing episode.

330
00:17:11.220 --> 00:17:13.079
And gosh, the show looks good.

331
00:17:13.380 --> 00:17:20.700
Yes, and and that whole sequence on those travelling things that

332
00:17:20.700 --> 00:17:23.339
they were on when he slapped his hand and it fell off, I just

333
00:17:23.339 --> 00:17:24.720
burst out laughing.

334
00:17:24.779 --> 00:17:27.299
Yeah, it was so much fun.

335
00:17:28.259 --> 00:17:32.279
At that speed from that high tea would have broken his neck.

336
00:17:32.339 --> 00:17:33.240
It's doctor.

337
00:17:34.319 --> 00:17:37.500
He's a space psycho nerd.

338
00:17:38.880 --> 00:17:41.099
There's a gravity curtain.

339
00:17:41.160 --> 00:17:42.180
There's a gravity curtain.

340
00:17:42.240 --> 00:17:43.200
Oh, yeah, see.

341
00:17:43.200 --> 00:17:44.099
Head cannon?

342
00:17:45.180 --> 00:17:46.740
All right.

343
00:17:46.799 --> 00:17:53.339
Well, you heard the soft sound of the timer, which was

344
00:17:53.339 --> 00:17:56.819
broadcasting itself through James's watch for no adequately

345
00:17:56.819 --> 00:17:59.339
explored reason, which meant it was very quiet.

346
00:17:59.460 --> 00:18:02.940
So we might do concluding remarks if anyone has any.

347
00:18:03.059 --> 00:18:04.619
Eight out of 10.

348
00:18:05.160 --> 00:18:07.259
Stop ranking everything.

349
00:18:07.500 --> 00:18:12.720
No, just enjoy it. 9 out of 9 out of 10.

350
00:18:13.019 --> 00:18:16.859
I was just absorbed and engrossed and I just relaxed and enjoyed

351
00:18:16.859 --> 00:18:18.720
it and I thought of that.

352
00:18:18.720 --> 00:18:22.680
Yeah, I thought it was the funnest episode so far. you know, but

353
00:18:22.680 --> 00:18:26.279
don't pay any attention to me because I enjoyed the Saranga

354
00:18:26.279 --> 00:18:27.240
conundrum, so...

355
00:18:30.839 --> 00:18:34.859
All right, well, that's about all we have time for.

356
00:18:34.920 --> 00:18:38.519
We'll be back next week, but in great Jody interterra tradition

357
00:18:38.519 --> 00:18:42.059
we're not going to spoil the title for you, because I can't

358
00:18:42.059 --> 00:18:42.539
remember it.

359
00:18:42.599 --> 00:18:49.319
And you can catch our Christopher Eccleston, our giant epic

360
00:18:49.319 --> 00:18:53.519
Christopher Eccleston retrospective this Sunday when we release

361
00:18:53.519 --> 00:18:53.819
it.

362
00:18:53.880 --> 00:18:56.940
And of course, we'll be back. bigger on the outside.

363
00:18:57.000 --> 00:18:59.579
It's bigger in every possible direction.

364
00:19:01.440 --> 00:19:03.059
I didn't.

365
00:19:03.059 --> 00:19:03.599
Anyway.

366
00:19:03.660 --> 00:19:04.500
That's just my waist.

367
00:19:05.099 --> 00:19:06.900
Keblam.

368
00:19:07.319 --> 00:19:09.180
Oh, dear.

369
00:19:09.240 --> 00:19:09.960
All right.

370
00:19:10.019 --> 00:19:13.019
Well, I guess we'll sign off.

371
00:19:13.079 --> 00:19:16.740
So we'll just put a big exclamation mark at the end of the

372
00:19:16.740 --> 00:19:17.160
episode.

373
00:19:17.220 --> 00:19:19.680
James.

374
00:19:19.740 --> 00:19:20.339
Do you have anything to say?

375
00:19:20.400 --> 00:19:20.880
No.

376
00:19:20.940 --> 00:19:21.299
Okay.

377
00:19:21.359 --> 00:19:22.079
All right.

378
00:19:22.140 --> 00:19:23.279
All right, thanks, guys.

379
00:19:23.339 --> 00:19:27.059
I look forward to chatting to you all. to chatting to you all next

380
00:19:27.059 --> 00:19:27.240
week.

381
00:19:27.299 --> 00:19:28.380
See you later.

382
00:19:28.500 --> 00:19:29.099
Bye.

383
00:19:29.160 --> 00:19:29.700
Bye.

384
00:19:29.759 --> 00:19:30.599
Later.

385
00:19:30.839 --> 00:19:33.000
I thought you weren't going to do that.