WEBVTT NOTE This transcript was created on 2026-06-07 at 12:50:27 1 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:10.380 Hello, dear listener, and welcome back to Jody Interterterra, the only Doctor Who flashcast that travelled back in time to inspire the creation of Doctor Who itself. 2 00:00:10.439 --> 00:00:12.000 No need to thank us. 3 00:00:12.060 --> 00:00:13.199 I'm Nathan. 4 00:00:13.259 --> 00:00:14.039 I'm James. 5 00:00:14.099 --> 00:00:15.480 I'm Brendan. 6 00:00:15.539 --> 00:00:16.800 I'm Todd. 7 00:00:16.859 --> 00:00:18.179 And I'm Stephen. 8 00:00:18.600 --> 00:00:25.019 So we have all spent the last few days learning how to pronounce the haunting of Villa Diodarte. 9 00:00:25.079 --> 00:00:28.079 And we are ready to talk about it. 10 00:00:28.260 --> 00:00:31.559 So Stephen, what did you think? 11 00:00:31.920 --> 00:00:37.740 I thought this was the most enjoyable episode of Jody's reign since Rosa for me. 12 00:00:38.640 --> 00:00:40.799 Wow, fantastic. 13 00:00:40.859 --> 00:00:42.299 Yeah. 14 00:00:42.359 --> 00:00:42.659 Okay. 15 00:00:42.719 --> 00:00:49.979 Well, Todd, I've heard that you watch this one alone in a darkened room, weeping into a box of big finish audio CDs. 16 00:00:50.039 --> 00:00:51.119 So what did you think? 17 00:00:51.359 --> 00:00:53.159 Well, Nathan. 18 00:00:53.219 --> 00:00:54.479 It's not quite true. 19 00:00:54.539 --> 00:01:02.100 I've just got off a plane from LA where I watched this with 1500 other Doctor Who fans at the Gallifrey one convention. 20 00:01:02.159 --> 00:01:07.560 And I have to say watching it with 1500 other people was just an amazing experience. 21 00:01:07.620 --> 00:01:12.840 Um, I thought this episode was absolutely phenomenal. 22 00:01:12.959 --> 00:01:28.439 And, uh, Um, like Stephen, I think this is the best episode since of her since Rosa, she was absolutely fantastic the moment she said, well, she, she said a lot of things to quite a few men and put them in their places. 23 00:01:28.500 --> 00:01:36.780 The highlight of which was like, this is not a flat structure in terms of hierarchy, which I just thought was brilliant. 24 00:01:36.840 --> 00:01:40.980 And I have to give kudos to an episode where the valet almost steals the show. 25 00:01:42.599 --> 00:01:51.239 It must have been amazing watching it with an audience because the valet did just the most amazing comedy bits that were so well judged. 26 00:01:51.299 --> 00:01:53.579 Like the laughter throughout, I think. 27 00:01:53.640 --> 00:01:55.019 Yeah, yeah. 28 00:01:55.079 --> 00:01:56.579 It was funny, don't you think, Todd? 29 00:01:56.640 --> 00:02:14.400 Oh, that's, but that's what I love in Doctor Who, is the fact that when you have something that is so captivating and on edge of, edge of your seat and thrilling that, that in those, those, those moments of sheer terror that you get the humour and I, and I think that's something the Doctor Who um, other shows learn off Doctor Who, really. 30 00:02:14.460 --> 00:02:15.300 Brilliant. 31 00:02:15.360 --> 00:02:15.960 Thanks. 32 00:02:16.020 --> 00:02:19.379 Brendan, what did your left nostril think of this episode? 33 00:02:21.000 --> 00:02:27.780 For those of you at home who don't know, my 1st try recording a walk to work with Whittaker this week. 34 00:02:27.840 --> 00:02:34.139 I used the macro lens on my camera and basically recorded my nose and extreme close-up talking about this episode. 35 00:02:34.439 --> 00:02:37.020 Is that a sort of red dwarf? 36 00:02:39.300 --> 00:02:47.280 But look, I have to agree with Todd and Stephen, I thought this was a fantastic episode. 37 00:02:47.340 --> 00:03:16.199 I did say in my YouTube review that, I wondered about sort of underusing Mary Shelley a bit, but I, I've kept thinking about that, and I think actually she was used very well in that, every action she takes in the plot is intelligent and brave and she, you know, and she's a big part of the resolution of the story as well. 38 00:03:16.259 --> 00:03:22.139 Um, yeah, I thought it was really balanced, the companions all got stuff to do. 39 00:03:22.199 --> 00:03:25.919 Wonderful scene with Ryan, which I may go further into later at the piano. 40 00:03:25.979 --> 00:03:34.139 But yeah, overall, another strong episode in a really strong run of Doctor Who, that we've had since Nicola Tesla's Night of Terror. 41 00:03:34.199 --> 00:03:37.860 Or Orphan 55 if you're Pete Lambert. 42 00:03:38.580 --> 00:03:41.099 James, what are you, Pete? 43 00:03:45.840 --> 00:03:47.879 No, no, I loved it. 44 00:03:48.659 --> 00:03:51.060 For the 1st time... 45 00:03:52.199 --> 00:03:54.659 Well, in a couple of episodes. 46 00:03:54.719 --> 00:04:14.939 No, I really, I really enjoyed the, the dark sort of Gothic horror kind of element, something that is traditionally a very Doctor Who staple that they haven't done that well for a long time, I think, I think is, is what impressed me about it. 47 00:04:15.000 --> 00:04:30.060 I, uh, I also felt that Mary Shelley was a little underused. especially given that the story is basically implying that this is the inspiration for Frankenstein. 48 00:04:31.800 --> 00:04:43.500 But when she was used, like, like Brendan said, like, really well done, thoughtful, um, great actress in this episode. 49 00:04:43.560 --> 00:04:50.279 Um, Richard made her made a quite interesting observation. 50 00:04:50.339 --> 00:04:52.560 He couldn't be here tonight. 51 00:04:52.620 --> 00:04:53.279 He's working. 52 00:04:53.339 --> 00:04:54.959 Poor bastard. 53 00:04:55.019 --> 00:05:03.180 Um, But that um, Byron, Shelley, and Mary would make good doctors this year of the show. 54 00:05:03.540 --> 00:05:08.100 I'm voting for John Polidori, actually. 55 00:05:08.160 --> 00:05:11.639 Well, yes, of course you are. 56 00:05:11.639 --> 00:05:13.019 Years and years, fan. 57 00:05:13.079 --> 00:05:18.779 I want to say that I think that this is Jody's best episode. 58 00:05:18.899 --> 00:05:24.300 For me, this ranks higher than Rosa, which I have political problems with. 59 00:05:24.420 --> 00:05:27.899 Um, but uh, you know, racist. 60 00:05:27.959 --> 00:05:29.100 Well, no, no, no. 61 00:05:29.100 --> 00:05:31.439 It's too not racist. 62 00:05:31.500 --> 00:05:49.079 No, I thought that this was incredibly enjoyable and I just thought it was like a masterclass in how to deal with, you know, 4 regulars and a bunch of really kind of well-drawn guest characters in 50 minutes. 63 00:05:49.139 --> 00:05:51.600 It can be done. and I thought it was done really well here. 64 00:05:51.660 --> 00:05:54.000 Plus atmosphere plus all sorts of other stuff. 65 00:05:54.060 --> 00:05:54.420 It was good. 66 00:05:54.540 --> 00:05:55.379 What reminded me of? 67 00:05:55.439 --> 00:05:57.839 Well, tooth and claw. 68 00:05:57.839 --> 00:05:58.920 In a good way. 69 00:05:58.980 --> 00:05:59.699 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 70 00:05:59.759 --> 00:06:00.420 Okay. 71 00:06:00.480 --> 00:06:02.519 Good celebrity historical. 72 00:06:02.579 --> 00:06:13.680 So it basically falls into 2 parts, so let's talk about the haunting and then let's talk about the lone cyberman. 73 00:06:13.740 --> 00:06:15.959 How many lone cybermen, are there, James? 74 00:06:16.019 --> 00:06:16.980 Just the one. 75 00:06:17.040 --> 00:06:18.540 Just the lone cyberman. 76 00:06:18.600 --> 00:06:26.100 So, um, Stephen, what did you think of the 1st half, the kind of just more straightforward horror bit? 77 00:06:26.160 --> 00:06:29.639 Look, I really enjoyed this for a number of reasons. 78 00:06:29.699 --> 00:06:43.620 There's so many callbacks too, a lot of the classic Doctor Who stories that I enjoy, whether that's the image of the Fendal or Castra Valver, it also reminded me of horror of Fang Rock in the way that it was very much a chamber piece and an atmospheric one as well. 79 00:06:43.680 --> 00:06:47.519 So, um, all of that was just tick, tick, tick. 80 00:06:47.579 --> 00:06:54.779 And I think it's probably a stronger aspect of the story than the sort of the lone cyberman part, which I guess we'll talk about later. 81 00:06:54.839 --> 00:06:57.779 But this one was wonderful. 82 00:06:57.839 --> 00:07:04.980 Like I kept thinking this has to have an amazing explanation in terms of the pop mechanics to justify what we're seeing here. 83 00:07:05.040 --> 00:07:06.420 And it did. 84 00:07:06.480 --> 00:07:09.300 I just couldn't fault it. absolutely wonderful. 85 00:07:09.360 --> 00:07:11.879 What did you think, Todd? 86 00:07:12.180 --> 00:07:15.420 Look, I completely agree with Stephen. 87 00:07:15.480 --> 00:07:27.480 Like I was thinking, cast your vow of a horror fang rock as I was, as I was watching this, and I, and I just, I just laughed my head off the fact that Graham seems to have been haunted by 2 other ghosts than everybody else. 88 00:07:27.540 --> 00:07:33.779 I just couldn't stop laughing and laughing about that, but which, whether or not we get any other explanations. 89 00:07:33.839 --> 00:07:34.439 I don't care. 90 00:07:34.500 --> 00:07:37.319 It was just hilarious, but also freaky. 91 00:07:37.379 --> 00:07:39.240 Love that comedy moment. 92 00:07:39.600 --> 00:07:42.120 Oh, didn't you didn't you see them? 93 00:07:42.839 --> 00:07:45.720 You said there were no such thing as goes. 94 00:07:45.720 --> 00:07:46.620 Unless there are. 95 00:07:46.680 --> 00:07:48.899 Yeah, it was really good. at the end. 96 00:07:48.959 --> 00:07:57.060 It leaves it open to not having an explanation and it can just be, you know, there are such things as, you know, how does that go? 97 00:07:57.120 --> 00:08:00.480 There are more things in heaven and earth. 98 00:08:00.540 --> 00:08:01.379 Yeah, in your philosophy. 99 00:08:01.439 --> 00:08:05.399 Wrong writer. love that. 100 00:08:05.459 --> 00:08:12.000 Do you know, Mary Shelley's 18 when this happens, I think, in 1816. 101 00:08:12.240 --> 00:08:16.079 And the thing that I thought it sold really well is that everyone's so insanely young. 102 00:08:16.079 --> 00:08:24.480 And that scene where they're dancing and doing the crucial, who is who and how is everyone related to everyone? 103 00:08:24.540 --> 00:08:25.800 I loved that. 104 00:08:25.860 --> 00:08:29.639 That was such a clever way to do that info dump. 105 00:08:29.699 --> 00:08:31.920 Yeah, yeah, yeah. through gossip. 106 00:08:31.980 --> 00:08:33.000 Yeah, yes. 107 00:08:33.059 --> 00:08:43.440 Oh, and yeah, like the lightness of touch with the, like she calls herself, she calls herself Mary Shelley, but they're not married. 108 00:08:43.500 --> 00:08:51.899 And basically, she's an unwed mother in, yeah, in a period when that's not okay. 109 00:08:51.960 --> 00:08:52.919 Yeah, yeah. 110 00:08:52.980 --> 00:08:59.700 No, well, I mean, both of them are, that's why everyone's in, in, uh, in, anyway. 111 00:08:59.759 --> 00:09:00.179 Yeah, yeah. 112 00:09:00.240 --> 00:09:04.440 They went away to avoid scandal, yeah. 113 00:09:04.500 --> 00:09:05.100 Yeah. 114 00:09:05.100 --> 00:09:05.460 Yeah. 115 00:09:05.519 --> 00:09:13.799 I don't think her father particularly approved of Percy, but her parents had written about, you know, this institution, a marriage thing. 116 00:09:13.860 --> 00:09:15.360 Why is that such a big deal? 117 00:09:15.419 --> 00:09:19.559 You know, they were quite forward thinking people and that's where Mary gets it from. 118 00:09:19.980 --> 00:09:21.360 Yeah. 119 00:09:21.419 --> 00:09:23.940 Yeah, that dance scene was wonderful. 120 00:09:24.000 --> 00:09:30.059 The scene I was referring to earlier with Ryan is where he and Mary are at the piano and... 121 00:09:31.379 --> 00:09:38.220 It's just, it's a subtle reference to his dyspraxia, but how the character relates to it differently. 122 00:09:38.279 --> 00:09:45.779 The 1st time we ever see Ryan back in the woman who fell to earth, he's talking about how he can't do things because of his dyspractia, like he can't ride a bike. 123 00:09:45.840 --> 00:09:55.440 Now, he attempts playing the piano and he knows that it's imperfect, but he just keeps trying and that's been the growth of his character. 124 00:09:55.500 --> 00:10:03.659 And, and it's all done without him saying to Mary Shell, oh, yeah, I've got this thing where what I tell my body to do, it doesn't always do properly. 125 00:10:03.720 --> 00:10:12.960 And instead, it's just expressed through the character's philosophy in this really nice character moment that then leads to that wonderful comedy bit of Polidori challenging him to a duel. 126 00:10:13.019 --> 00:10:25.740 And again, the butler, Fletcher, who the, sorry, the valet Fletcher, I should say, who has already been pointed out, amazing piece of performance, just rolls his eyes on, oh, no, not again. 127 00:10:27.659 --> 00:10:30.899 Especially seeing as Polidori's narcoleptic. 128 00:10:31.019 --> 00:10:32.820 So does he fall asleep during duels? 129 00:10:32.879 --> 00:10:34.200 I suppose so. 130 00:10:34.500 --> 00:10:36.720 Isn't that how he died? 131 00:10:38.759 --> 00:10:50.340 The other thing too, I thought the atmosphere was really interesting because you're used to these sort of these, you know, I mean, it's the same year that Emma, Jane Austen, publishes Emma. 132 00:10:50.399 --> 00:10:56.759 So, you know, those sort of Austin adaptations where everything is sort of very flat and evenly lit. 133 00:10:56.820 --> 00:11:03.600 And here everything seemed to be being lit by sort of practical, you know, candles and things. 134 00:11:03.659 --> 00:11:15.419 I mean, I'm sure it wasn't, but just that darkness at night, which would have been what everyone what everyone was experiencing, just sold the atmosphere so well. 135 00:11:15.720 --> 00:11:17.100 Yeah. 136 00:11:17.159 --> 00:11:32.700 So something about that atmosphere that I noted that took me a while to get used to because we're so unused to this, even in Doctor Who, you know, we've talked on flight through entirety before how historicals are like theme park historicals, they're quite neat, they're quite clean, you know what I mean? 137 00:11:32.759 --> 00:11:35.519 But here, there's all this. 138 00:11:35.759 --> 00:11:43.379 It seems like smoke in the air and hey, probably from all the candles and oil lamps they're burning and that kind of thing. 139 00:11:43.500 --> 00:11:50.460 And it kind of gives the picture a dreamlike quality, whereas last week, the ship in, Can you hear me? 140 00:11:50.519 --> 00:11:53.759 Very crisp and all those purple neons and what have you. 141 00:11:53.820 --> 00:11:58.919 And it, in a way, it took me a little while to get into the story because of that. 142 00:11:58.980 --> 00:12:03.299 But once I was in there, I'm like, 0 no, this has drawn me into this setting. 143 00:12:03.360 --> 00:12:04.139 It just took me a while. 144 00:12:04.740 --> 00:12:11.700 Does Do any of the sort of guest characters sort of particularly strike you, Stephen? 145 00:12:12.240 --> 00:12:15.779 I mean, all of them are wonderful and wonderfully played. 146 00:12:15.840 --> 00:12:17.879 I mean, there's such a giant of literature. 147 00:12:17.940 --> 00:12:26.220 So, of course, you know, being a literature student once upon a time, just sort of having that on the screen and in a Doctor Who, again, just wonderful. 148 00:12:26.279 --> 00:12:30.600 I thought Byron in particular was amazing and Shelley too. 149 00:12:30.659 --> 00:12:31.620 I think all of them, really. 150 00:12:32.039 --> 00:12:33.480 Yeah. 151 00:12:33.539 --> 00:12:34.559 What about you, Todd? 152 00:12:34.620 --> 00:12:36.299 Was there anyone you liked particularly? 153 00:12:37.500 --> 00:12:41.820 Um, who was the guy that hid behind Shelley? 154 00:12:41.879 --> 00:12:42.360 Who was that? 155 00:12:42.539 --> 00:12:45.360 That's Lord Byron. 156 00:12:45.360 --> 00:12:47.879 Lord Byron hid behind Claire Claremont. 157 00:12:47.940 --> 00:12:48.600 Oh sorry. 158 00:12:48.659 --> 00:12:49.980 Yeah, it's my jet lag. 159 00:12:51.539 --> 00:12:53.340 Yes, of course. 160 00:12:53.399 --> 00:13:04.019 I thought he was great in being such a cad and, and, and that gave opportunity for, for all the ladies and of course, the doctor to put him in his place. 161 00:13:04.080 --> 00:13:11.340 In fact, that rule, the don't snog Lord Byron rule that the doctor has established at the beginning. 162 00:13:11.399 --> 00:13:14.519 And like Yaz thinks that she might actually do it. 163 00:13:14.580 --> 00:13:25.860 And I actually quite like the fact that we're slightly sexualising the doctor, this female doctor for the 1st time in a way that they've sort of avoided a little bit. 164 00:13:25.919 --> 00:13:27.299 And she's having none of it. 165 00:13:27.360 --> 00:13:28.500 Yeah, it's wonderful. 166 00:13:28.620 --> 00:13:36.899 Can you get that wonderful bit at the end where, you know, he tries his shtick with, um, with Claremont. 167 00:13:36.960 --> 00:13:37.740 Claremont. 168 00:13:38.340 --> 00:13:39.240 They clear a terrible name. 169 00:13:40.620 --> 00:13:46.440 Didn't you get that fantastic bit at the end where he tries to pick up Claire Clermont again. 170 00:13:46.500 --> 00:13:50.100 And she's like, no, you used me as a human shield. 171 00:13:50.159 --> 00:13:51.539 You can go me myself. 172 00:13:51.960 --> 00:13:56.279 Well, you see, that's my my sort of standout. 173 00:13:56.340 --> 00:14:05.820 Of course, Lily Miller does an amazing job as Mary Shelley, but my standup because of that scene is Nadia Parks is Claire Claremont. 174 00:14:05.879 --> 00:14:21.299 Now, when we were talking about series three, I think we all at one point or another said this Martha subplot of being in love with the doctor has gone on too long and it just goes to show you can do Martha's entire subplot in 50 minutes because Claremont gets it. 175 00:14:21.960 --> 00:14:23.820 Oh, you're wonderful. 176 00:14:23.879 --> 00:14:24.720 Oh, you're brilliant. 177 00:14:24.779 --> 00:14:25.980 Oh, you're a bit rubbish, actually. 178 00:14:26.279 --> 00:14:28.799 And I'm worth 10 of you. 179 00:14:30.659 --> 00:14:32.220 Awesome. 180 00:14:32.279 --> 00:14:38.159 So let's move on to the chief villain of the piece, the lone cyberman. 181 00:14:38.580 --> 00:14:44.279 How do we feel about this half of the episode? 182 00:14:44.340 --> 00:14:46.080 I might ask you again, Stephen. 183 00:14:46.139 --> 00:14:59.100 Look, I think it's very strong, but it just maybe doesn't quite sort of stack up to the promise of the 1st half, and it's very much, I think, 25 minutes in, we get into that 2nd half, and the lone side sort of materialises in the hallway in the house there. 184 00:14:59.639 --> 00:15:07.080 I don't know, perhaps the way in which it's establishes a bit of a runaround, and I'm not sure if that sort of appealed to me. 185 00:15:07.139 --> 00:15:19.740 There was that wonderful exchange, though, between Shelley and, I guess, the Frankenstein monster, if you like, the cyber, the lone cyberman towards the end, which I thought was really effective, and kind of sowed the seeds of where the Frankenstein idea comes from. 186 00:15:19.799 --> 00:15:21.419 That was quite lovely. 187 00:15:21.480 --> 00:15:30.960 But obviously it's kind of like a utopia kind of episode where we're setting up for the next 2 parts in the season finale and I thought this was equally as enjoyable. 188 00:15:31.679 --> 00:15:35.580 How did you feel about the lone sideman, Todd? 189 00:15:36.059 --> 00:15:38.879 I didn't have a problem with it. 190 00:15:38.940 --> 00:15:53.700 I couldn't work out whether or not I'd been spoiled to know that that's what it was, and certainly that shot when they look out the window down to the lake and and all of that lightning and all that stuff's happening, which I thought was a beautiful shot. 191 00:15:53.940 --> 00:16:01.500 It reminded me a bit of Mordred Undead when they look back up the grass to where, you know, the obelisk thing is. 192 00:16:01.620 --> 00:16:04.740 No, I didn't have a problem with that at all. 193 00:16:04.799 --> 00:16:05.580 I thought it was great. 194 00:16:05.580 --> 00:16:10.440 And that confrontation scene between her and the monster was brilliant. 195 00:16:10.440 --> 00:16:19.860 And no, I, I, it needed to, something needed a kicking to change gears, I think, halfway through to sort of start sowing the seeds of why all this is happening. 196 00:16:19.860 --> 00:16:21.419 And I had no problem with that at all. 197 00:16:21.539 --> 00:16:33.840 I just, I thought it was tremendously well used and, and I just thought it was very telling that this, that, to this episode that it wasn't a one that was written by X-riter and Chris Chipnall. 198 00:16:33.899 --> 00:16:41.879 It was the writer doing all this at, you know, putting all this plot stuff in and succeeding without having to go to a committee. 199 00:16:41.940 --> 00:16:43.019 So I was just really impressed. 200 00:16:43.139 --> 00:16:53.820 I wonder whether we would be, uh, whether we would have been quite so impressed by the haunted house thing had it kind of outstayed its welcome a bit. 201 00:16:53.879 --> 00:17:01.500 Like, I think giving us that much, leaving us wanting a bit more and then changing tack halfway through is probably the right decision. 202 00:17:01.559 --> 00:17:05.579 But what about the, you know, is he a shard? 203 00:17:05.700 --> 00:17:06.839 A shard? 204 00:17:06.900 --> 00:17:07.980 A shard himself? 205 00:17:08.039 --> 00:17:09.000 What did you think, Brendan? 206 00:17:09.359 --> 00:17:12.359 Um, look, an excellent idea. 207 00:17:12.599 --> 00:17:33.960 As I've often said, Cybermen are my favourite Doctor Who monsters, and when, you know, I sort of heard a while ago that Cybermen might be back, world enough in time, their last story is my favourite Cybermen story, and it's kind of like, 0 my god, how are they going to stack up? 208 00:17:33.960 --> 00:17:41.880 And, It's amazing that the Chibnol era looks at Cybermen and goes, okay, what's the Cybermen's defining feature? 209 00:17:41.940 --> 00:17:42.839 They have no emotions. 210 00:17:42.900 --> 00:17:45.420 Well, yet, chuck that out the window. 211 00:17:45.839 --> 00:17:55.799 And let's not only have a sidemen with emotions, This side man is psychotic and tells us he was psychotic before he became a cyberman. 212 00:17:55.859 --> 00:18:21.119 And what I, what I love about that scene with Mary Shelley is, it's kind of an inversion of the conversation that happens between Frankenstein and the monster where Dr. Frankenstein himself is cruel and callous to the monster and rejects him and the monster by instinct is actually a compassionate and caring creature who only becomes bitter and violent, through having bitterness and violence thrust upon him. 213 00:18:21.180 --> 00:18:30.359 So I was kind of left with the impression, 0 my god, when Mary comes to write this story, she writes the monster as she wishes the monster she met had been. 214 00:18:30.420 --> 00:18:40.259 So this cyberman is both Frankenstein, Dr. Frankenstein and his monster in one. spooky And just the design. 215 00:18:40.319 --> 00:18:44.700 I just want to call out Ray Holman, who is the costume designer. 216 00:18:44.759 --> 00:18:49.140 He is on Twitter and he is just a lovely enthusiastic guy on there. 217 00:18:49.200 --> 00:18:50.759 Looks amazing. 218 00:18:50.819 --> 00:18:52.500 We've got a 10th planet arm. 219 00:18:52.619 --> 00:18:54.359 We've got nightmare and silver body. 220 00:18:54.420 --> 00:18:56.700 We've got a new helmet and all this stuff. 221 00:18:56.759 --> 00:18:59.579 Yeah, just really effectively done. 222 00:18:59.759 --> 00:19:12.900 I think too, now we're, you know, so many seasons in after the introduction of the Cyberman, and you had Moffat kind of retconning them as a thing that happens to kind of humanity eventually over and over again. 223 00:19:12.960 --> 00:19:22.440 The idea that the sidemen are this sort of motley collection of things that are designed in all sorts of different ways and are even kind of conceived in different ways. 224 00:19:22.500 --> 00:19:23.579 I think is really good. 225 00:19:23.640 --> 00:19:27.420 And I loved the doctor's explanation of who they were. 226 00:19:27.480 --> 00:19:29.160 I thought that that was so well done. 227 00:19:29.220 --> 00:19:35.940 Her anger at the thought that they might hurt her friends. 228 00:19:36.000 --> 00:19:37.680 Yeah, yeah, what happened to Bill. 229 00:19:37.740 --> 00:19:45.119 And that's our kind of first, you know, it's sort of our 1st reference to... in a way. 230 00:19:45.180 --> 00:19:45.480 Yeah. 231 00:19:45.599 --> 00:19:48.660 At least his emotional impact on the character. 232 00:19:48.720 --> 00:19:49.559 Yeah. 233 00:19:49.619 --> 00:19:50.039 Yeah. 234 00:19:50.099 --> 00:19:50.579 Yeah. 235 00:19:51.000 --> 00:19:52.559 All right. 236 00:19:52.619 --> 00:19:59.400 Well, let's do just a sort of quick roundup of how we thought the doctor went this week, because I think there are things to say about that. 237 00:19:59.460 --> 00:20:00.960 What do you think, Brendan? 238 00:20:01.380 --> 00:20:09.180 Um, quite possibly Jody's fiercest performance to date. 239 00:20:09.720 --> 00:20:19.799 I say fiercest because, you know, there have been other stories where she's been quite strong, but the strength has come from sort of confusion or being on the back foot. 240 00:20:19.859 --> 00:20:30.779 Whereas here she's proactive throughout, and my god, that the look on her face when Ryan basically says, yeah, kill Byron for all the people in the future. 241 00:20:30.839 --> 00:20:37.259 And there's this look which I interpreted as the doctor said, thinking, 0 my god, is that what I've taught you three? 242 00:20:37.799 --> 00:20:44.579 I actually have to say that I think that that was slightly muddled that whole kind of trolly problem thing. 243 00:20:44.640 --> 00:20:46.319 Like, I'm not quite sure. 244 00:20:46.380 --> 00:20:48.480 I think that was one of the weaknesses of the episode. 245 00:20:48.539 --> 00:20:50.519 Well, you've been spoiled by the good place. 246 00:20:50.579 --> 00:20:51.480 Well, maybe. 247 00:20:51.599 --> 00:20:55.799 But I do think that her performance in it was just incredible. 248 00:20:55.859 --> 00:21:02.039 And in an episode where she gets to be funny and silly and witty and all of those things. 249 00:21:02.099 --> 00:21:05.700 I mean, this is how I want her to be all the time. 250 00:21:05.700 --> 00:21:08.220 And this is what she always is at her best. 251 00:21:08.279 --> 00:21:16.619 I think that this is, you know, as far as performance goes, this is the best material she's had and she's really, really risen to it. 252 00:21:16.740 --> 00:21:18.420 And I would agree. 253 00:21:18.720 --> 00:21:20.099 Yeah. 254 00:21:20.160 --> 00:21:22.619 Did you have anything more to add to that though, Todd? 255 00:21:22.680 --> 00:21:24.660 No, I don't think so. 256 00:21:24.720 --> 00:21:47.400 I think this is her best performance and all of those things help her, help her shine and I just loved the fact that she had something to get her teeth into and she managed to, she was given the opportunity to be funny and to be pissed off and to be, um, and to have agency and and to be very unimpressed with with people and and she delivered. 257 00:21:47.460 --> 00:21:49.140 Yeah, just wonderful. 258 00:21:49.500 --> 00:21:51.779 Stephen, we haven't heard from you. 259 00:21:52.079 --> 00:22:04.859 I also thought this was Jody's best performance for a long time, but I still feel like the Rosa episode is where we saw, I think what I guess I wanted to see from Jody's doctor. 260 00:22:04.920 --> 00:22:08.700 And right from the beginning, what is it, the second, the 3rd episode of her run. 261 00:22:08.759 --> 00:22:16.799 It's almost disappointing that we've had to wait this long again to get a performance of that kind of stature and think. 262 00:22:16.859 --> 00:22:18.420 And it's not so much Jodi. 263 00:22:18.480 --> 00:22:19.799 I think it's the material. 264 00:22:19.859 --> 00:22:21.779 And in this instance, where she's just given gold. 265 00:22:21.839 --> 00:22:24.059 It comes through wonderfully. 266 00:22:24.119 --> 00:22:31.079 I don't know if I fully accept the flat structure mountain sort of piece, but the rest of it's wonderful. 267 00:22:31.079 --> 00:22:36.059 And as you say, in the 1st half in particular, when she's all funny and silly, that's the doctor. 268 00:22:36.119 --> 00:22:38.099 That's the doctor right there and we got we got it. 269 00:22:38.819 --> 00:22:40.200 Yeah. 270 00:22:40.259 --> 00:22:47.339 Well, I think we could wind it up there unless anyone has a closing statement. 271 00:22:47.759 --> 00:22:51.779 I just have to say that toast and coal is that gorgeous in real life. 272 00:22:52.859 --> 00:22:55.259 We saw the photo. 273 00:22:55.619 --> 00:22:58.019 He was great this week. 274 00:23:00.299 --> 00:23:02.460 And he's very funny too. 275 00:23:02.519 --> 00:23:06.660 Like, he's got a natural humour, like, you know, in his interviews and stuff over the weekend. 276 00:23:06.720 --> 00:23:09.900 You can see why he was cast in that role. 277 00:23:09.960 --> 00:23:13.019 Yeah, they're really starting to use him properly for that too. 278 00:23:13.079 --> 00:23:14.279 He's really very good. 279 00:23:14.519 --> 00:23:16.019 All right. 280 00:23:16.079 --> 00:23:17.099 Well, we might wind that up. 281 00:23:17.160 --> 00:23:27.420 We're going to be back next week, obviously, at this time for the 1st in a two-part Chris Chibnell penned finale, which we're not going to spoil the title of because I can't remember it right now. 282 00:23:27.480 --> 00:23:28.259 Oh, it's terrible. 283 00:23:28.319 --> 00:23:29.220 I just remembered. 284 00:23:29.279 --> 00:23:30.059 Never mind. 285 00:23:30.359 --> 00:23:32.880 Tension of Cyberman. 286 00:23:32.940 --> 00:23:35.700 That's it Elevation of the bandrels. 287 00:23:36.480 --> 00:23:39.059 Superannuation of the side of man. 288 00:23:39.420 --> 00:23:42.720 So we might finish up there. 289 00:23:42.779 --> 00:23:53.160 Todd, thank you so much for joining us on, you know, it must be 4 o'clock in the morning or something by your local circadian clock, is that right? 290 00:23:53.220 --> 00:23:54.420 have no idea. 291 00:23:54.480 --> 00:23:55.799 How are you feeling? 292 00:23:55.859 --> 00:23:56.880 am I? 293 00:23:57.779 --> 00:24:01.980 I'm okay now, but you know, a few hours ago I was really struggling. 294 00:24:02.039 --> 00:24:03.539 So this is both... 295 00:24:03.839 --> 00:24:07.680 I can, I've managed to string 2 sentences together, so there you go. 296 00:24:07.799 --> 00:24:09.420 Well done, you've done well. 297 00:24:09.480 --> 00:24:12.660 And Stephen, thank you very much for joining us. 298 00:24:12.720 --> 00:24:16.740 So I had no idea that you were going to do that until you actually called in. 299 00:24:16.859 --> 00:24:19.259 So I'm very happy to speak to you. 300 00:24:19.319 --> 00:24:20.759 Thank you, Mr. managed. 301 00:24:21.119 --> 00:24:22.740 Brilliant. 302 00:24:22.740 --> 00:24:25.259 Special guest star, Stephen B. Yeah. 303 00:24:25.319 --> 00:24:31.740 So until next time, may you find a nice hat with a plume somewhere, one that really suits you. 304 00:24:31.799 --> 00:24:33.299 Love a good plume. 305 00:24:33.359 --> 00:24:35.819 Thank you very much for listening and good night. 306 00:24:35.940 --> 00:24:36.599 Good night. 307 00:24:36.660 --> 00:24:37.440 Good night. 308 00:24:37.500 --> 00:24:38.640 See you soon. 309 00:24:38.700 --> 00:24:39.480 Be seeing you.