WEBVTT NOTE This transcript was created on 2026-06-07 at 12:50:08 1 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:15.419 Hello, dear listener, and welcome back to Jody and Terra, the only Doctor Who flash cast where all of the gay characters are still alive by the end of the episode, unless something deeply tragic and unexpected happens in the next 20 minutes. 2 00:00:15.480 --> 00:00:16.019 I am Nathan. 3 00:00:16.079 --> 00:00:16.980 I'm Brendan. 4 00:00:17.039 --> 00:00:19.320 I'm Todd, and I'm Peter. 5 00:00:19.379 --> 00:00:22.980 So we have watched Praxius this week. 6 00:00:23.100 --> 00:00:35.100 And so we are here to tell you what we think of it, and so we will start in the usual way with a little quick trip round the horn to ask people basically how they felt the episode went. 7 00:00:35.159 --> 00:00:37.140 Let's start with Pisa. 8 00:00:37.619 --> 00:00:44.159 Hmm, well, it was co-credited, but I can't believe that there was too, too much of old Chris in that episode. 9 00:00:44.219 --> 00:00:47.820 It was too fresh to kind of light on its feet. 10 00:00:47.880 --> 00:00:58.200 Um, I did perhaps feel his cold dead hand and less subtlety of the lesson of the week, but um, you know, I really liked using our plastic contamination of the planet. 11 00:00:58.259 --> 00:01:02.039 That is a great doctor who set up and it gave me all the green death feels. 12 00:01:02.219 --> 00:01:04.560 So yeah, thumbs up. 13 00:01:04.620 --> 00:01:05.579 Brilliant. 14 00:01:05.640 --> 00:01:06.659 Todd? 15 00:01:06.840 --> 00:01:09.840 I liked it, I didn't love it. 16 00:01:09.900 --> 00:01:11.099 Oh, okay. 17 00:01:11.159 --> 00:01:11.760 Okay. 18 00:01:11.819 --> 00:01:18.359 Do you want to go into that in more detail when we discussed individual things or was there something in particular that stood out for you? 19 00:01:19.019 --> 00:01:25.620 I thought the companions were used well, and I liked the guest cast. 20 00:01:25.680 --> 00:01:27.239 Yeah, yep. 21 00:01:27.299 --> 00:01:28.500 I think they were both strong. 22 00:01:28.560 --> 00:01:29.640 What about you, Brendan? 23 00:01:30.000 --> 00:01:40.680 Um, look, this is another one I really enjoyed and I feel like, um, Nicola Tesla's Night of Terror and Spy Fall. 24 00:01:40.739 --> 00:01:46.560 This level of quality feels like our new normal, and I'm okay with that. 25 00:01:47.280 --> 00:01:56.219 Yeah, I have to say that sometimes I feel like I'm grading these episodes on a curve a bit, to be completely honest, but I don't feel that here. 26 00:01:56.280 --> 00:01:59.459 I was really very, very impressed with this episode. 27 00:01:59.519 --> 00:02:00.420 I thought it was great. 28 00:02:00.480 --> 00:02:14.819 And, you know, like I thought last week was great, but it cheated a little bit with the sort of, here's a new doctor reveal, whereas this one, you know, I was just sort of unreservedly impressed by, I think. 29 00:02:15.180 --> 00:02:27.360 So let's start with what for me was the biggest deal, which is that we've finally kind of done something about gay male representation in Doctor Who. 30 00:02:27.479 --> 00:02:31.379 Everyone assumes there are lots of gays in Doctor Who, but there aren't really. 31 00:02:31.439 --> 00:02:34.139 And, you know, usually about half of them are dead. 32 00:02:34.199 --> 00:02:39.120 I was trying to think of who's been gay in Doctor Who before and the list is not long. 33 00:02:39.419 --> 00:02:43.319 Do you know why I think people assume that there's a lot of gays in Doctor Who? 34 00:02:43.379 --> 00:02:44.699 Because Russell wrote it? 35 00:02:44.759 --> 00:02:45.900 Yes. 36 00:02:46.020 --> 00:02:58.500 And because Russell was such a big present and so kind of effusive and such a good spokesman for the show, people assume there's been more gay characters than they have been because it was just Russell being lovely on our TV all the time. 37 00:02:58.560 --> 00:02:59.159 Exactly. 38 00:02:59.219 --> 00:02:59.699 Yeah. 39 00:02:59.759 --> 00:03:06.419 Yeah, and you remember that there were no gay characters in series 5 and people critiqued Stephen Moffatt for that. 40 00:03:06.479 --> 00:03:12.360 And then he brought in the fat one and the thin one, which I just think was really terrible. 41 00:03:13.860 --> 00:03:17.039 But here, I don't think the word gay is used. 42 00:03:17.099 --> 00:03:18.240 Is the word gay used? 43 00:03:18.300 --> 00:03:19.919 There's no things about coming out. 44 00:03:19.979 --> 00:03:23.939 It's a little bit like the relationship in sort of resolution or something. 45 00:03:24.000 --> 00:03:26.819 Is there a relationship in resolution or did I dream that? 46 00:03:26.879 --> 00:03:30.120 Well, there's there's a budding relationship in resolution. 47 00:03:30.180 --> 00:03:30.659 Yeah. 48 00:03:30.659 --> 00:03:30.960 Yeah. 49 00:03:31.020 --> 00:03:31.500 Yeah. 50 00:03:31.560 --> 00:03:33.479 So and it's just a marriage. 51 00:03:33.539 --> 00:03:36.240 It's just people who are married, there's nothing about coming out. 52 00:03:36.360 --> 00:03:39.599 There's nothing about, you know, enduring homophobia. 53 00:03:39.659 --> 00:03:45.060 They are just 2 people who are in love and the that romance is super central to it. 54 00:03:45.120 --> 00:03:52.319 Like Jody says, you know, she's a romantic and Graham was lovely with them, you know, the whole thing I just thought was terrific. 55 00:03:53.759 --> 00:04:02.219 And on that, on that thing of, it's not a declarative thing that they're gay. 56 00:04:02.280 --> 00:04:03.599 It's just a fact of the plot. 57 00:04:03.719 --> 00:04:14.280 As well as that Pete McTyre and Chris Chipnell have chosen to give these 2 Professions which stereotypically little boys look up to. 58 00:04:14.340 --> 00:04:15.360 Yeah, okay. 59 00:04:15.360 --> 00:04:17.699 Astronaut, astronauts and police officers. 60 00:04:17.819 --> 00:04:26.399 And especially if you if you look at the UK, Police are more highly regarded by the public, shall we say? 61 00:04:26.459 --> 00:04:27.720 Yeah. 62 00:04:27.779 --> 00:04:36.060 And and so, you know, when we hear he's a police officer. but also seems to be a bit overzealous, but his overzealousness is tackling people. 63 00:04:36.120 --> 00:04:41.220 It's not, you know, getting aggressive and whatnot. 64 00:04:41.279 --> 00:04:56.339 And we find out through the course of the thing that actually that's part of the reason for his fall from grace, as it were, is the problems in his marriage, which he is able to say in this, actually, a lot of it is coming from my end. 65 00:04:56.399 --> 00:05:15.420 And I particularly loved between those 2 characters, the acknowledgement of the prestige imbalance, if you like, of an astronaut who goes into space and a police officer who is currently on sabbatical and working security in a supermarket. 66 00:05:15.480 --> 00:05:24.540 Well, I mean, I kind of got the impression that he was just working at a supermarket and but that he was just a bit of an asshole and he sort of, you know, tackled children and stuff. 67 00:05:25.199 --> 00:05:28.319 And, you know, like I kind of... 68 00:05:28.319 --> 00:05:42.839 Yeah, yeah, because he seemed like such a loser in that 1st episode with lovely old Joyce, you know, giving him the flick, you know, not charging the kid, but making him sort of go for a walk. 69 00:05:43.259 --> 00:05:45.899 Yeah, I like that too. 70 00:05:45.959 --> 00:05:49.800 He got to be a loser, the relationship got to be a bit kind of rocky. 71 00:05:49.860 --> 00:05:53.040 Um, and Graham doing marriage counselling. 72 00:05:53.100 --> 00:05:54.000 It was just tremendous. 73 00:05:54.600 --> 00:05:58.079 It was a lovely moment for him, this episode. 74 00:05:58.079 --> 00:06:05.399 And, yeah, no, I thought that was, you know, I mean, that was Graham's moment and it was lovely to give that to him. 75 00:06:05.459 --> 00:06:09.360 There was some, there was some subtlety for Graham this week. 76 00:06:09.420 --> 00:06:15.360 Normally, the subtlety comes out of his performance, but he was given some in this episode. 77 00:06:15.420 --> 00:06:18.000 It's beautiful, that scene, isn't it? 78 00:06:18.060 --> 00:06:24.420 Where, you know, do you know what it's like to be married to someone who's much more impressive than you? 79 00:06:24.480 --> 00:06:28.439 And I watched it again last night and Graham's reaction. 80 00:06:28.500 --> 00:06:29.519 Do you know what I mean? 81 00:06:29.579 --> 00:06:35.879 There's no way that that's not intentional and it's just nice to have some subtext for a change, I think. 82 00:06:36.720 --> 00:06:40.439 You know, Pete writes Yaz differently from normal as well. 83 00:06:40.500 --> 00:06:42.180 Or should I say he writes her? 84 00:06:42.600 --> 00:06:45.420 She's some, she's sarkia. 85 00:06:45.480 --> 00:06:46.439 She's more independent. 86 00:06:46.500 --> 00:06:48.180 She's given a character. 87 00:06:48.240 --> 00:06:50.100 I mean, Mandip can bring it. 88 00:06:50.160 --> 00:06:50.759 So helper. 89 00:06:50.819 --> 00:06:52.500 Yeah, yeah. was really good. 90 00:06:52.560 --> 00:06:57.540 And in fact, you know, splitting the actors up, someone suggested that there was a production reason for it. 91 00:06:57.540 --> 00:07:07.500 It's a little bit like having a double banked episode where, you know, you need everyone for a bit less time because everyone's doing things separately. 92 00:07:07.560 --> 00:07:12.540 But I thought it just worked really well because it just gave everyone room to do something. 93 00:07:12.899 --> 00:07:16.800 Yeah, I enjoy these globetrotting stories. 94 00:07:16.920 --> 00:07:19.259 Um, uh, Spiteful. 95 00:07:19.319 --> 00:07:21.600 Oh, sorry, Spyeful, Spyful, Spyeful. 96 00:07:21.720 --> 00:07:23.879 I did well because of that. 97 00:07:23.939 --> 00:07:27.000 And you know what, the production is leaning into it. 98 00:07:27.060 --> 00:07:36.600 The series has looked fuller and more produced this year compared to last year's kind of vacant sparseness of Mise en Sen. 99 00:07:37.439 --> 00:07:40.259 But you know the one episode last year that didn't have that problem? 100 00:07:40.319 --> 00:07:41.100 Kblam. 101 00:07:41.939 --> 00:07:43.379 Yeah. 102 00:07:43.439 --> 00:07:49.139 Yeah, I mean, they really seem to, you know, be making the show look better than it ever has. 103 00:07:49.199 --> 00:07:54.300 And I just thought that was sort of, that was really fantastic, you know, really something. 104 00:07:55.500 --> 00:07:59.220 Yeah, and proper funny jokes as well. 105 00:07:59.279 --> 00:08:10.139 Like, um, uh, the humour hasn't always been kind of as deaf as this in the last couple of years, and there are some real sort of genuine, funny lines. 106 00:08:10.199 --> 00:08:21.060 I do love the moment where Graham tells Jake what a catch he is, you know, and Jake kind of laughs and realises actually, yes, you know, maybe this is all largely my fault. 107 00:08:22.680 --> 00:08:24.720 It's so great. 108 00:08:24.779 --> 00:08:25.800 So great. 109 00:08:25.860 --> 00:08:38.580 Graham even nails the stupid holding the device upside down kind of choke, which is really stupid, but because it's done by Graham, you know, because it's done by Bradley Walsh, it just lands. 110 00:08:38.639 --> 00:08:40.919 It's absolutely perfect Yeah. 111 00:08:40.980 --> 00:08:47.279 And I think the other thing that helps that scene, it's a little thing in that is that it's a red dwarf joke. 112 00:08:47.340 --> 00:08:55.740 It's absolutely a red dwarf joke and usually what would happen is Graham would finish the line, then Yaz would pick up the thing, stare at it, and put it back down again. 113 00:08:55.799 --> 00:08:57.840 Yaz doesn't even wait for him to finish talking. 114 00:08:57.960 --> 00:08:59.220 Yeah, yeah. 115 00:08:59.279 --> 00:09:00.659 And when he resumes the line. 116 00:09:00.720 --> 00:09:05.159 He does it with the exact identical intonation as he did it the 1st time. 117 00:09:05.220 --> 00:09:06.240 Yeah. 118 00:09:06.240 --> 00:09:07.259 As if it had never happened. 119 00:09:08.519 --> 00:09:10.200 Nice moment. 120 00:09:10.259 --> 00:09:11.519 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 121 00:09:11.820 --> 00:09:19.440 Yeah, Graham has been a bit too much used for obvious comic relief for me a bit this year. 122 00:09:19.500 --> 00:09:28.500 So it was nice, 1st of all, to have his comedy a bit more underplayed this episode and to give him that dramatic moment we were talking about earlier with Jake. 123 00:09:28.799 --> 00:09:32.700 I was really glad to see that because Bradley Bradley Walsh. 124 00:09:32.759 --> 00:09:40.559 I mean, he can do the broad and he can do the subtle, but when he's when he's doing the broad, you kind of want to just say, okay, bring it down a bit, mate. 125 00:09:40.620 --> 00:09:45.360 When he's doing the subtle, it's like, no, actually I really like you and I want to go on adventures with you. 126 00:09:46.379 --> 00:09:49.740 And I think Towson had a lot to do this week as well. 127 00:09:49.799 --> 00:10:00.840 And um, I thought he was, uh, you know, he was great in that very 1st scene of his with with Gabrielle, where he kind of gets to be the guy in charge. 128 00:10:00.899 --> 00:10:07.620 Um, and, you know, his reaction to being told that he saved the world by bringing the bird is actually really lovely as well. 129 00:10:08.039 --> 00:10:17.580 But also talking to her in the TARDIS and I thought that was a nice moment again from him and I was really impressed by her. really enjoyed her character. 130 00:10:18.120 --> 00:10:21.539 Do you know I liked the Tartar set this week? 131 00:10:22.980 --> 00:10:25.740 Yeah, say that again, Nathan. 132 00:10:25.860 --> 00:10:27.899 You can't quite believe it. 133 00:10:30.600 --> 00:10:37.860 I actually really like the darkness of it with the glowing and the, you know, the practical light on everyone's faces and stuff. 134 00:10:37.919 --> 00:10:50.220 And, you know, they're kind of, they've got this sort of big problem of these sort of, um, uh, you know, big pillars kind of occluding the view of the uh, of the console. 135 00:10:50.279 --> 00:10:56.700 So they're kind of doing things outside that sort of circle and I think it just, I think it looks good. 136 00:10:56.759 --> 00:10:57.600 I'm liking it. 137 00:10:57.659 --> 00:10:59.940 Sorry. weird. 138 00:11:00.059 --> 00:11:07.679 So I've just got a message from Richard saying that he thought that the, that it was nice that the plot was, uh, was complex. 139 00:11:07.740 --> 00:11:17.580 You know, he texted us earlier about all the gays surviving, but he thought that the plot was just sort of good and sort of complex because it is a bit of a puzzle. 140 00:11:17.639 --> 00:11:21.659 It's not a Moffat style puzzle, but it is these weird things are happening. 141 00:11:21.720 --> 00:11:23.340 How can they possibly be linked? 142 00:11:23.399 --> 00:11:27.659 And I think that that the answer to that is actually pretty satisfying. 143 00:11:28.559 --> 00:11:37.980 Yeah, the episodes, um, in, I think in the in the Chibnal era tend not to be adventurous in their storytelling. and this was fuller. 144 00:11:38.039 --> 00:11:38.940 It had more to it. 145 00:11:39.000 --> 00:11:40.320 Yeah, yeah. 146 00:11:40.379 --> 00:11:45.120 So are we cross about another environmental message? 147 00:11:45.240 --> 00:11:47.399 so soon after the previous one? 148 00:11:50.039 --> 00:11:50.820 This one's competent. 149 00:11:53.039 --> 00:11:55.139 The words out of my mouth. 150 00:11:58.440 --> 00:12:13.799 So, I, you know, I have been urged Brendan to, to reinforce to you that Orphan 55 is a camp classic, and we'll be all talking about it in 10 years' time. 151 00:12:14.700 --> 00:12:21.480 And I like the way that message was told, even though, you know, it was sort of fighting the rest of the episode. 152 00:12:21.539 --> 00:12:24.120 Here I thought what was interesting about the message is. 153 00:12:24.179 --> 00:12:34.440 It was kind of a message about plastic, but it wasn't, you know, it wasn't metaphorical or it wasn't the plastic itself that was the thread or anything like that. 154 00:12:34.500 --> 00:12:41.519 It was just a thing that was happening against a background of the way that we filled the biosphere with plastic. 155 00:12:41.580 --> 00:12:42.899 Do you know what I mean? 156 00:12:42.960 --> 00:12:47.820 And we learned more about it and all of that sort of thing, but it wasn't sort of science fictionalised. 157 00:12:48.120 --> 00:12:50.879 It's just a feature of the world that we live in. 158 00:12:51.539 --> 00:12:54.419 Yeah, and it wasn't. 159 00:12:55.200 --> 00:12:59.820 These microplastics are out there and Doctor Who is going to fix that. 160 00:12:59.879 --> 00:13:02.820 It was, these microplastics are out there. 161 00:13:02.879 --> 00:13:04.440 Owen, we've got that alien threat. 162 00:13:04.500 --> 00:13:09.600 But hey, you at home, how about you think about the fact that these plastics are out there while we go off and deal with this? 163 00:13:09.659 --> 00:13:10.679 Yeah. 164 00:13:10.740 --> 00:13:19.379 I thought that was, you know, that was a nice subtle thing that you get to the end of the episode and you're like, yeah, Doctor Who saved us from the disease. 165 00:13:19.440 --> 00:13:21.120 Sorry, the pathogen, I should say. 166 00:13:21.179 --> 00:13:27.659 But hold on, there's there's still these big bergs of plastic in the middle of the ocean. 167 00:13:27.720 --> 00:13:28.620 Yeah. 168 00:13:28.679 --> 00:13:30.299 Yeah, 5 of them. 169 00:13:30.360 --> 00:13:31.379 They use the word gyre. 170 00:13:31.500 --> 00:13:38.279 You know, I'd heard of that, but I didn't know that they were like, they had names and stuff like that and we all knew where they were. 171 00:13:38.340 --> 00:13:42.120 And I don't think I really knew that we were kind of full of microplastics. 172 00:13:42.720 --> 00:13:49.500 Yeah, the thing is, though, we didn't have a 2 minute explanation of what a gyre was, so I'm afraid that moment just didn't land for me. 173 00:13:50.519 --> 00:13:53.519 I still think the plot. 174 00:13:53.580 --> 00:14:07.559 So this plot was so complicated that it did require maybe a bit too much exposition, but there was like, you know, Jody was playing it so well and there was enough action that I thought it, you know, could get away with it. 175 00:14:10.620 --> 00:14:21.059 So, Todd, I'm I'm curious to know what the things you weren't satisfied about were because there's 2 particular things I wasn't satisfied about and I want to see if we've got a bingo. 176 00:14:21.179 --> 00:14:21.899 Oh. 177 00:14:21.960 --> 00:14:22.860 Um. 178 00:14:23.700 --> 00:14:28.919 I didn't particularly like a lot of the explanationary scenes. 179 00:14:28.980 --> 00:14:56.159 Um, I just didn't feel feel that, um, Jody's voice was in the right in there and, um, there were some, There was only, it might have been at 4 or 5 lines in those scenes where I just felt it was hitting like when you play the piano and you hit the wrong note or it's out of tune and and it felt a bit like last season with her trying to be funny or or trying to explain what she's doing. 180 00:14:56.220 --> 00:15:00.179 And I think that's probably Chris Chibnall sawdust coming into those scenes. 181 00:15:00.659 --> 00:15:10.320 And the fact that our composer doesn't underscore them like Murray Gold means they have to stand or fall on their own merits. 182 00:15:10.379 --> 00:15:14.039 And so those scenes I really did struggle with. 183 00:15:14.100 --> 00:15:21.899 I watched it twice and the 1st time through, I really did struggle. with the episode quite a bit, but I enjoyed it much more the 2nd time through. 184 00:15:21.960 --> 00:15:24.659 Um, Oh, look. 185 00:15:25.139 --> 00:15:36.419 My few minor quibbles were the fact that, yes, we're going to set it up and a tent in a rubbish tip and sleep there overnight because like, you know, the stench wouldn't get to you. 186 00:15:36.480 --> 00:15:37.200 That's one of the things. 187 00:15:37.259 --> 00:15:38.940 There were flies everywhere. 188 00:15:39.000 --> 00:15:40.019 I'm sorry. 189 00:15:40.080 --> 00:15:42.179 Nobody in their right mind would do that. 190 00:15:42.240 --> 00:15:46.379 Secondly, um, then the poor guy on the beach who got eaten by the birds. 191 00:15:46.440 --> 00:15:47.519 Well, let's not even mention him. 192 00:15:47.580 --> 00:15:53.820 And the other thing was, um, Oh, what was the other one? 193 00:15:53.879 --> 00:16:00.240 Oh, yes, I'm in space and I've got my mobile phone and they've captured me, but I've still got time to text my location. 194 00:16:00.299 --> 00:16:01.379 I kind of went, really? 195 00:16:01.440 --> 00:16:04.559 So they were my little quibbles. with the episode. 196 00:16:04.620 --> 00:16:05.700 Hmm. 197 00:16:05.759 --> 00:16:06.840 What about you, Brendan? 198 00:16:06.960 --> 00:16:11.279 Well, the thing is, the whole explanation of the pathogen. 199 00:16:11.340 --> 00:16:16.860 I just thought was really poorly written because instead of Ryan saying, is it bad? 200 00:16:16.919 --> 00:16:17.700 I don't know what that is. 201 00:16:17.759 --> 00:16:22.139 He could try and take a guess, he could try and say, is that like a virus or is that different from a virus? 202 00:16:22.200 --> 00:16:28.559 You know, instead both he, just for that scene, both he and Graham are written as idiots. 203 00:16:28.620 --> 00:16:30.899 So the doctor can explain this. 204 00:16:30.899 --> 00:16:47.159 And, um, a friend, a friend of mine in the medical profession, he, his specialism is not virology or anything like that, but he's like, I don't think that's what, I don't think that's actually a good explanation of what a pathogen is, so to go to all that trouble. 205 00:16:47.220 --> 00:16:50.340 But yeah, Todd, my other big thing was Paul Arabu. 206 00:16:50.399 --> 00:16:51.659 Yeah. 207 00:16:51.659 --> 00:17:01.019 One, he does the horror movie thing of, well, I could stand next to this door and watch these birds so that if anything bad happens, I can run inside. 208 00:17:01.080 --> 00:17:05.940 But not only that, he's like, I'm just going to get closer to these things which are acting aggressively and weirdly. 209 00:17:06.480 --> 00:17:14.460 Did anybody, did anybody get the, um, animatronic cat vibe from survivor with the birds sitting up watching them? 210 00:17:14.519 --> 00:17:16.319 I love that. 211 00:17:16.319 --> 00:17:18.539 I love that book because it was weird looking. 212 00:17:18.599 --> 00:17:22.740 Like it looked like it had eaten a whole bunch of plastic. did not look well. 213 00:17:22.799 --> 00:17:25.740 I don't look like an animatronic. 214 00:17:25.799 --> 00:17:26.819 Sure it was. 215 00:17:28.019 --> 00:17:31.500 I thought those bird effects were entirely too good. 216 00:17:31.559 --> 00:17:35.819 Speaking of the green death, I thought we could have had back that flying insect or something. 217 00:17:37.559 --> 00:17:42.539 It looked like the pigeon from mongrels, if you've ever seen mongrels. 218 00:17:42.599 --> 00:17:44.160 It was a BBC show and a puppet. 219 00:17:44.220 --> 00:17:45.359 I did, Brent. 220 00:17:46.440 --> 00:17:49.500 I forget her name, but it looks like that pigeon. 221 00:17:50.160 --> 00:17:51.720 Brilliant. 222 00:17:51.779 --> 00:17:56.640 Yeah, and bloody, bloody Gabriella's like, oh, no, my friend is dead, but hey, time machine. 223 00:17:56.700 --> 00:17:57.480 Awesome. 224 00:17:57.539 --> 00:18:02.940 And hey, at the end, I'm just going to go off and blog with 2 new people, forget about my poor friend. 225 00:18:03.779 --> 00:18:11.039 I actually am not sure that criticism's entirely fair because I did see it quite a lot over the last couple of days. 226 00:18:11.099 --> 00:18:26.279 And the episode spends quite a bit of time on a Gabrielle's reaction to Jamilla's death, including that scene in the Tardis with Ryan and her being sort of angry and wanting to beat something up in Hong Kong. 227 00:18:26.339 --> 00:18:43.799 And I'm reading that final scene as being some time after, you know, the previous scene where they've, you know, rung the European Space Agency and said, oh, you know, not dead and all of that sort of thing. 228 00:18:43.859 --> 00:18:46.200 So, like, it's Doctor Who. 229 00:18:46.259 --> 00:18:57.240 We, you know, think about Rose in the eponymous episode, Rose, where Mickey is killed and she is perfectly fine with it and running hand in hand and laughing with the doctor, you know, mere minutes later. 230 00:18:57.299 --> 00:19:02.220 I think that, you know, death in Doctor Who needs to be given more weight than it was in the classic series. 231 00:19:02.279 --> 00:19:04.140 But I thought that sort of happened. 232 00:19:04.200 --> 00:19:06.720 I don't think she read as happy until that final scene. 233 00:19:07.319 --> 00:19:11.279 Actually, that's, you know what, that's a good comparison with Rose and Mickey. 234 00:19:11.339 --> 00:19:12.420 That's a good comparison. 235 00:19:12.480 --> 00:19:13.380 Yeah. 236 00:19:14.160 --> 00:19:18.900 Um, Something little I noticed in the final scene. 237 00:19:19.019 --> 00:19:25.859 Um, the jacket that Adam is wearing. actually seems to be Ryan's from last series. 238 00:19:26.279 --> 00:19:35.160 And given how careful Ray Holman is, I do have to wonder if the implication is Ryan has given him that jacket, so he's got some clothes to go home in. 239 00:19:35.460 --> 00:19:37.140 That's quite nice. 240 00:19:37.200 --> 00:19:41.579 Yeah, I don't know why they dropped them off in Madagascar apart from the fact that it's a very pretty location. 241 00:19:42.359 --> 00:19:45.539 I guess it's for Jake and Adam's honeymoon. 242 00:19:45.599 --> 00:19:46.799 Can we talk about that? 243 00:19:46.859 --> 00:19:49.680 Can, you know, can we talk about the ending? 244 00:19:49.740 --> 00:19:52.140 Who thought they were killing Jake? 245 00:19:52.200 --> 00:19:53.039 Todd? 246 00:19:53.759 --> 00:20:08.700 Um, I thought one of them was going to die one way or the other, and then when we had the survival, I thought, oh, no, they're both going to live and then when he went up into the ship, I thought, oh, okay, we are. 247 00:20:08.759 --> 00:20:10.740 So, yeah. 248 00:20:10.799 --> 00:20:14.640 No, it was, yeah, look, I'm glad they both survived. 249 00:20:14.700 --> 00:20:16.859 Did you think they were going to die? 250 00:20:16.920 --> 00:20:18.660 Did you think either of them was going to die, Peter? 251 00:20:18.960 --> 00:20:25.740 Um, I didn't actually, because um, I didn't think that the writer would do that. 252 00:20:25.799 --> 00:20:26.579 Yeah. 253 00:20:26.640 --> 00:20:27.240 Yeah. 254 00:20:27.299 --> 00:20:28.920 I think that's probably fair. 255 00:20:28.980 --> 00:20:30.660 I had a little moment. 256 00:20:30.779 --> 00:20:31.980 Did you, Brendan? 257 00:20:32.039 --> 00:20:33.660 Were you ever... 258 00:20:33.720 --> 00:20:35.220 Oh, absolutely. 259 00:20:35.279 --> 00:20:42.960 I was convinced, 1st of all, when the doctor has some line about, ooh, the autopilot, the autopilot should work. 260 00:20:43.019 --> 00:20:45.900 I thought, well, okay, well the astronaut's going to run in there. 261 00:20:45.960 --> 00:20:55.319 But of course, Pete or Pete and or Chris very carefully put in the line where Jake's like, this is actually really simple. 262 00:20:55.380 --> 00:20:56.460 Like your job is easy. 263 00:20:56.579 --> 00:20:59.640 Um, so he runs in and does it. 264 00:20:59.700 --> 00:21:01.380 That has a character. 265 00:21:01.500 --> 00:21:03.119 That has a character purpose, doesn't it? 266 00:21:03.180 --> 00:21:10.079 He's been intimidated by Adam all this time and then he just discovers that all he's been doing is pressing up down left and right all this time. 267 00:21:10.140 --> 00:21:11.640 Yeah, yeah. 268 00:21:11.700 --> 00:21:17.160 I was just going to say, look, has every, has everyone on the call seen the midseason trailer? 269 00:21:17.279 --> 00:21:18.779 No. 270 00:21:18.839 --> 00:21:19.200 Yes. 271 00:21:19.259 --> 00:21:30.359 Okay, I won't, there's a moment in that, which I thought came from this scene, which I thought meant that Jake was going to die. 272 00:21:30.420 --> 00:21:31.380 Ah okay. 273 00:21:31.440 --> 00:21:40.740 And the thing is, I have to say, the direction in that bit by Jamie Magnus Stone really leads us to believe that the doctor is not going to make it. 274 00:21:40.799 --> 00:21:46.440 And then it's just a very subtle, like, because we've got an extreme close up of Jake's face. 275 00:21:46.500 --> 00:21:49.920 The actual materialisation is so well done. 276 00:21:50.400 --> 00:21:55.740 And, of course, has led half of Twitter to say, well, why don't you rescue Adric? 277 00:21:55.799 --> 00:21:57.660 And it's just like, it's stupid. 278 00:21:58.319 --> 00:22:04.079 Well, no, it's obvious he just couldn't be asked, you know, like... 279 00:22:04.079 --> 00:22:07.920 But also, I drinks not half of a hot gay couple. 280 00:22:07.980 --> 00:22:09.119 That's my client. 281 00:22:09.839 --> 00:22:17.160 But, you know, it's just like, it's kind of like if the doctor doesn't rescue people, fans get annoyed. 282 00:22:17.220 --> 00:22:21.240 Like, 0 no, you know, the doctor's been neutered and they're not doing things and da da da. 283 00:22:21.299 --> 00:22:25.319 And then when the doctor does rescue someone, inevitably, someone says, oh, Well, what about Adri? 284 00:22:25.380 --> 00:22:28.200 It's like, it was 1982. 285 00:22:28.500 --> 00:22:30.599 It was 1982. 286 00:22:30.720 --> 00:22:31.980 He couldn't fly the ship. 287 00:22:32.039 --> 00:22:33.900 It had been damaged by the cybercontroller people. 288 00:22:33.960 --> 00:22:35.579 Cyberleaguer. 289 00:22:35.640 --> 00:22:37.200 The ship was phasing in and out of time. 290 00:22:37.259 --> 00:22:38.579 It's all there in the script. 291 00:22:38.640 --> 00:22:39.839 Exactly. 292 00:22:39.900 --> 00:22:40.259 Yeah. 293 00:22:40.319 --> 00:22:43.380 And it's Eric Saywood, someone had to die. 294 00:22:43.440 --> 00:22:48.960 Yeah, clearly the doctor decided that Jake was an Ida, and Adrick was nude. 295 00:22:49.079 --> 00:22:51.059 That's it. 296 00:22:51.119 --> 00:22:52.019 That's it. 297 00:22:52.079 --> 00:22:54.299 Well, I was relieved. 298 00:22:54.359 --> 00:23:00.660 I think that was that was just fantastic and literally the best gay male representation we've ever had on the show. 299 00:23:00.720 --> 00:23:05.880 So maybe I'm adding a whole bunch of points for that reason. 300 00:23:05.940 --> 00:23:09.119 All right, well, I think we may wind it up there. 301 00:23:09.180 --> 00:23:16.019 Unless anyone has any urgent closing statements to make. liked it. 302 00:23:16.079 --> 00:23:16.799 Good. 303 00:23:16.859 --> 00:23:17.819 Excellent. 304 00:23:17.880 --> 00:23:19.259 That's kind of closing statement I like. 305 00:23:19.319 --> 00:23:19.980 All right. 306 00:23:20.039 --> 00:23:27.599 Well, in that case, we'll be back next week for an episode whose title I can't remember and that I know nearly nothing at all about. 307 00:23:27.720 --> 00:23:30.059 So it's bound to be incredibly good. 308 00:23:30.119 --> 00:23:31.980 Would you like to know the title? 309 00:23:32.039 --> 00:23:34.740 Uh, it's called Can Papa Can? 310 00:23:34.799 --> 00:23:35.279 Can you hear me? 311 00:23:35.339 --> 00:23:36.240 Papa, can you hear me? 312 00:23:36.299 --> 00:23:37.019 Papa, can you hear? 313 00:23:37.079 --> 00:23:37.740 Yeah, okay, good. 314 00:23:37.799 --> 00:23:38.220 What? 315 00:23:39.000 --> 00:23:41.819 Actually, anyone hear me? 316 00:23:41.880 --> 00:23:42.660 Yes. 317 00:23:42.720 --> 00:23:43.559 Yes. 318 00:23:43.619 --> 00:23:44.460 That's what it's called. 319 00:23:44.519 --> 00:23:45.779 Brilliant. 320 00:23:45.839 --> 00:23:48.299 Okay, so it's a sequel to Revenge of the Cyberman. 321 00:23:48.359 --> 00:23:48.960 Okay. 322 00:23:49.019 --> 00:23:49.680 All right. 323 00:23:50.099 --> 00:23:59.759 So, until next time, nutritionists recommend that a healthy diet should consist of no more than 50,000 microplastic particles a year. 324 00:23:59.759 --> 00:24:03.900 So best to lay off the after dinner pop final figures for now. 325 00:24:03.960 --> 00:24:06.180 Thank you very much for listening and good night. 326 00:24:06.299 --> 00:24:07.859 Good night. 327 00:24:07.920 --> 00:24:08.819 See you soon. 328 00:24:08.880 --> 00:24:09.779 Good night. 329 00:24:15.839 --> 00:24:18.000 God, have you forgotten how to do this? 330 00:24:18.480 --> 00:24:23.220 No, no, it's just that I had a joke, so I was waiting for other people to go first. 331 00:24:23.279 --> 00:24:24.240 Oh, okay. 332 00:24:24.299 --> 00:24:27.960 Because my joke was, damn it, I'm halfway through eating John Hurt. 333 00:24:29.279 --> 00:24:31.140 I can do it again. 334 00:24:31.259 --> 00:24:33.240 We'll just put that in my bag.